New DS Live Box Set, 3rd November 2023!

[herlock]

What i would really like above all as a quality soundboard release is one of the last shows from 1981 (Paris, San Remo...). Unique versions and atmosphere. We only have Dortmund 80 with mono sound and Werchter 81 with atrocious sound, and no WDYTYRG.... I don't think besides these 2 there was any professional recording of this great tour?

[Darling Pretty]

A question did just pop in my mind : wans't the Mandela gig recorded using a multitrack ?

I don't think so, it was a live broadcast, those are usually just stereo mix for the radio and tv broadcast, not sure if many tv stations broadcasted in stereo in 1988.

Maybe they recorded it too in multitracks just in case, but everything I heard about this concert is just the stereo live broadcast.

The only thing that makes me doubt this is that there are definitely at least two different mixes of this concert in existence.  One is from the radio / TV stereo broadcast which is my favourite : it has flaws (like missing the first sax fill in Sultans) but lots of ambience.   The second mix can be found on the Superstar Concert Series release which aired after the event to US syndicated networks.   This is a cleaner, more clinical and direct mix which I am guessing was remixed after the concert. The Solid Rock Bootleg comes from this source.  I don't like it as much.

A third and final possible mix can be found on the official VHS.  This might just be a better quality version of the first radio mix I mention, but sounds great.

I'd really love an official release of this important concert in Dire Straits history.

I do not like the Solid Rock Bootleg as well. Clapton's guitar is not really there.
He is doing quite a brillant rythm part on BIA on that evening. Simply stunning.
By the way: DOES anytone has the great version from the Laser disc or BBC VHS from Brothers in Arms for me?
Is this really the best version out there?
I would really dig a PM of a FLAC version.

[the visitor]

A question did just pop in my mind : wans't the Mandela gig recorded using a multitrack ?

I don't think so, it was a live broadcast, those are usually just stereo mix for the radio and tv broadcast, not sure if many tv stations broadcasted in stereo in 1988.

Maybe they recorded it too in multitracks just in case, but everything I heard about this concert is just the stereo live broadcast.

The only thing that makes me doubt this is that there are definitely at least two different mixes of this concert in existence.  One is from the radio / TV stereo broadcast which is my favourite : it has flaws (like missing the first sax fill in Sultans) but lots of ambience.   The second mix can be found on the Superstar Concert Series release which aired after the event to US syndicated networks.   This is a cleaner, more clinical and direct mix which I am guessing was remixed after the concert. The Solid Rock Bootleg comes from this source.  I don't like it as much.

A third and final possible mix can be found on the official VHS.  This might just be a better quality version of the first radio mix I mention, but sounds great.

I'd really love an official release of this important concert in Dire Straits history.

Meant to add that this all leads me to believe there are multitrack tapes that allowed the "remix" for the Superstar Concert Series version of this concert. Just a theory but one I want to believe, leaving the door open for a future official version!

[Love Expresso]

I think there will be more Box Sets in the next years. A movie soundtrack box would be possible, and I am pretty sure that 2025 will see a Brothers In Arms Jubilee Box with many different formats. To cover the second half of the 1980's it could contain Wembley 85 and the Mandela gig. Maybe Live Aid as an bonus EP. Who knows if they come up with another surprising recording, same as they did with the fabulous Rainbow Show. Personally I just hope it will NOT contain Sydney as that one contains many of the most cringe DS moments ever. On the other hand, a proper mixed live version of Ride Across The River would be something. I guess Guy knows already what plans they have for the next years..

LE

[Jules]

I think there will be more Box Sets in the next years. A movie soundtrack box would be possible, and I am pretty sure that 2025 will see a Brothers In Arms Jubilee Box with many different formats. To cover the second half of the 1980's it could contain Wembley 85 and the Mandela gig. Maybe Live Aid as an bonus EP. Who knows if they come up with another surprising recording, same as they did with the fabulous Rainbow Show. Personally I just hope it will NOT contain Sydney as that one contains many of the most cringe DS moments ever. On the other hand, a proper mixed live version of Ride Across The River would be something. I guess Guy knows already what plans they have for the next years..

LE

According to Guy, the problem with the BIA recordings is that most of them are just stereo mixes, and he needs multitracks.

We don't know all the recordings they really have, but the guess is that at least they should have the Wembley 85 recording in multitracks, as the Rolling Stones Mobile was used to record the sound that for the tv broadcast, but the Sydney 86 was a live broadcast mixed directly in stereo with that purpose, and the San Antonio and Houston radio shows were also apparently live broadcasts in stereo.

I agree with the posibility of a movie scores box, as most of them are not in LP (Wag the dog or Altamira) and there are pieces of music MK wrote for tv shows or documentaries that were not released in any format (Charles and DI, Swan Hunter) and also many musical fragments that are in the films but not in the released scores, actually many of them are listed in ASCAP and ISWC (from Wag the dog and Metroland mostly) so that could be a big clue of something coming in that regard...

Metroland: https://www.amarkintime.org/forum/index.php?topic=6189.0

Wag the dog: https://www.amarkintime.org/forum/index.php?topic=2685.0

Charles and Di documentary: https://www.amarkintime.org/forum/index.php?topic=6254.0

Swan Hunter documentary: https://www.amarkintime.org/forum/index.php?topic=6190.0

[herlock]

Maybe I'm being naive, but what would be wrong in releasing the existing stereo mixes? I understand that with a multitrack recording you can mix it really according to your heart, but if it is already mixed, well, it is what it is, and sometimes quite ok. The semi-official San Antonio 85 concert that was released on CD and endorsed by the official DS YT channel sounds quite good to me. Not sure if it is PRE-FM or POST-FM, but surely the PRE-FM are available somewhere?

[Jules]

Maybe I'm being naive, but what would be wrong in releasing the existing stereo mixes? I understand that with a multitrack recording you can mix it really according to your heart, but if it is already mixed, well, it is what it is, and sometimes quite ok. The semi-official San Antonio 85 concert that was released on CD and endorsed by the official DS YT channel sounds quite good to me. Not sure if it is PRE-FM or POST-FM, but surely the PRE-FM are available somewhere?

The "endorsed" by the official youtube channel, I never consider it like any kind of official thing, but a way to monetize the bootlegs, as the copyright of it belongs to the brand DS, none of the bootleggers could claim about it, so they make money for the brand of things that they weren't.

What's the problem about the stereo mixes? That they are not good enough in their standards, so the only way to release a good enough thing, they need to remixe it from the original source, and in order to do a proper mix they need to mix all.

I know some artists are releasing stereo mixes just with a remaster, but looks like from MK and DS camp, if the original is not good enough for them and candidate to just remaster, they want a new mix, and for that, they need the multitracks.

The pre-FM is probably just stereo as the purpose was a live broadcast.

[Chris W]

There is very little incentive for any artists to officially release one-off live recordings. It can be a major priority for fans, but that doesn't mean a band has to agree.
jbaent is correct about the quality issue. But going beyond that, most live radio or tv recordings are made by local engineers, who don't know the music before the show. They're mixing it in real time not knowing what comes next. In my experience the drum sound is often sketchy.
When you look at the preparations for an official live recording - a world class recording engineer is brought in, who knows the music or who has seen the show multiple times. They record more than one show, they have all the instrument components on separate tracks for later balancing.
It's a completely different beast.

[Love Expresso]

The absence of the complete BIA era in the recent live box is very noticable and with 2025 in sight, there must be planned something separate. The Wembley Show was and is always a fan's favourite, so  I thought of it in the first place. As there was obviously no unreleased stuff recorded during the BIA era and because of now several different vinyl releases during the last years (half speed mastering and so on) my guess is they have to come up with sonething worthy. I agree with jbaent also as we all know that the quality standards in the MK/DS camp are very high. 

LE

[herlock]

Mark has been releasing on-the-fly mixes (sometimes quite so-so) of his solo concerts from 2005/2010 onwards...

[Love Expresso]

Mark has been releasing on-the-fly mixes (sometimes quite so-so) of his solo concerts from 2005/2010 onwards...

Yes and with every tour they got worse and worse.

LE

[herlock]

What strikes me is that everybody is longing for a BIA tour release (I do too!) but very few of us are longing for an OL tour release. OK, the 1979 Rainbow release is very cool, the raw versions of the early songs are awesome, but I also love the more developed versions from 1980/1981. Especially News, WDYTYRG, Lions, Angel of Mercy, which are quite epic. DTTW is less obvious, I find Hal's rhythm guitar is very quiet, can't be heard, whereas David's had a unique groove, but the keyboards gives a cool stadium atmosphere. And there is Skateway, and the very first versions of TR! An official Paris 1981 release would really make me happy... Sadly I don't think there is anything like that in the vaults.

[Jules]

The absence of the complete BIA era in the recent live box is very noticable and with 2025 in sight, there must be planned something separate. The Wembley Show was and is always a fan's favourite, so  I thought of it in the first place. As there was obviously no unreleased stuff recorded during the BIA era and because of now several different vinyl releases during the last years (half speed mastering and so on) my guess is they have to come up with sonething worthy. I ageee with jbaent also as we all know that the quality standards in the MK/DS camp are very high. 

LE

The absence of a BIA live recording in this box is logical, as this box was the continuity of the previous "Studio Box" released some years ago with all the DS studio records (except Extended Dance Play), so the next one logically was a "Live box" but this time they decided, luckily for us, include not only extra stuff in the Alchemy and OTN records, but also to include an unreleased concert, like the Rainbow 79, but in the end, it's a Live DS records box, like the previous one was a Studio DS records box.

The thing here is, why of the unreleased stuff they hopefully have, they decided to choose the Rainbow 79?

Probably you are right, and there is something already planned for the next BIA anniversary, I had the same thought as we know the Wembley concert was recorded properly, and someone already asked Guy and he said that there are plans in the future from the record company but, who knows which plans, next year is the 40th anniversary of Alchemy, and as far as they have the whole 22nd and 23rd recordings, a box with the whole concerts would be great, and then next year the 40th anniversary of BIA... Hopefully.

[Jules]

Mark has been releasing on-the-fly mixes (sometimes quite so-so) of his solo concerts from 2005/2010 onwards...

But thyey were not official releases by the record company in cd/lp physical format but digital downloads more for the fans and concert goers than the general public, and probably PCM convinced him that was a way to fund the tours partially...

[JF]

everybody is hopping something special for the BIA 40th anniversary...
I hope you are right, but.. we got nothing new for 10th, 20th and 30th anniversaries... so why would they do it for the 40th ?