New DS Live Box Set, 3rd November 2023!

[Rolo]

And before anyone think I'm being critical of the Box set I am not all that, I simply point something I believe to be true. On the night was overdubbed, probably in very small parts but it was, I read it, and the source may as well be MK himself in his usual matter-of-fact way: "we did some overdubs in the studio..." but I'll have to find my source back

Thank you

[dmg]

In 2021 I published on my blog about this aspect of CE on OTN, I ended the article by writing: The audio is basically a tremendous edit, a lot of mixes here, a lot of audio is from Nimes FRA 21. 05.92, but a lot of other parts are a lot of unknown mixes.

I made comparisons between the OTN CL with the Audio CL of Bootlegs Nimes FRA 21.05.92 and Rotterdam, Netherlands 5/31/1992, to complement my research and reach this conclusion.

So here is some data, (a lot of audio is from Nimes FRA 21. 05.92, but a lot of other parts are a lot of unknown mixes.)

The closest versions to the CE version of OTN are Nimes FRA 21.05.92 and Rotterdam, Netherlands 5/31/1992, having these bootlegs as a starting point, just analyze and compare, it is possible to identify the licks and notice that there are licks that they were probably made in the studio, or, it was taken from some other show, but, I point out that I analyzed all the bootleg recordings from Nimes and Rotterdam in May 1992 and only the dates I mentioned above have licks and vocal performances that are on OTN, with the exception of Mark's greeting with a "hey, Alright!" at the beginning of the song, that was taken from some other show, probably Paris in April 92.


Here is the link to the article I wrote.

https://universodirestraits.blogspot.com/2021/06/calling-elvis-on-night-performance.html?m=0

There aren't bootlegs circulating of the 1st or final shows in Rotterdam so sound could come from either of these performances.

[Brunno Nunes]

In 2021 I published on my blog about this aspect of CE on OTN, I ended the article by writing: The audio is basically a tremendous edit, a lot of mixes here, a lot of audio is from Nimes FRA 21. 05.92, but a lot of other parts are a lot of unknown mixes.

I made comparisons between the OTN CL with the Audio CL of Bootlegs Nimes FRA 21.05.92 and Rotterdam, Netherlands 5/31/1992, to complement my research and reach this conclusion.

So here is some data, (a lot of audio is from Nimes FRA 21. 05.92, but a lot of other parts are a lot of unknown mixes.)

The closest versions to the CE version of OTN are Nimes FRA 21.05.92 and Rotterdam, Netherlands 5/31/1992, having these bootlegs as a starting point, just analyze and compare, it is possible to identify the licks and notice that there are licks that they were probably made in the studio, or, it was taken from some other show, but, I point out that I analyzed all the bootleg recordings from Nimes and Rotterdam in May 1992 and only the dates I mentioned above have licks and vocal performances that are on OTN, with the exception of Mark's greeting with a "hey, Alright!" at the beginning of the song, that was taken from some other show, probably Paris in April 92.


Here is the link to the article I wrote.

https://universodirestraits.blogspot.com/2021/06/calling-elvis-on-night-performance.html?m=0

There aren't bootlegs circulating of the 1st or final shows in Rotterdam so sound could come from either of these performances.

That's why I mentioned, "that there are licks that were probably made in the studio, or were taken from some other show", in this case, it could be from these two shows in Rotterdam that we don't have recordings, but that the band.

[JF]

I choose Guy as a better source of information about this

Until then Occams razor suggests that the person who was actually responsible for the recordings might know a bit more than any of us here.

in theory yes. But in practice no.

there are several examples in DS/MK history where Guy and/or Mark made mistakes in interviews about dates, song titles, gig venues, guitars used in studio (Mark saying the 54 on trawlerman for example), etc... Guy didn't even know about the Alchemy date, etc...

They have for more than 40 years now, in so mnay records, so many tours, so many gigs.... how can they rememebr eveything exactly ? It's impossible.
And they aren't as mad as us 
So they don't care about such details like we do. When a record is finished, they d'ont even think about it after that... remember, they are always looking forward...

[2manyguitars]

I choose Guy as a better source of information about this

Until then Occams razor suggests that the person who was actually responsible for the recordings might know a bit more than any of us here.

in theory yes. But in practice no.

there are several examples in DS/MK history where Guy and/or Mark made mistakes in interviews about dates, song titles, gig venues, guitars used in studio (Mark saying the 54 on trawlerman for example), etc... Guy didn't even know about the Alchemy date, etc...

They have for more than 40 years now, in so mnay records, so many tours, so many gigs.... how can they rememebr eveything exactly ? It's impossible.
And they aren't as mad as us 
So they don't care about such details like we do. When a record is finished, they d'ont even think about it after that... remember, they are always looking forward...

Forgetting what Guitar you used on a song, or the particular eq settings on an amp is a totally different thing from having studio time booked at £1000 plus an hour, sitting in front of the recording desk, setting up amps, and trying to recreate said live sound. Totally different. That process wouldn't have been simple either, it would have involved several days of studio time, remember this is pre BG.

This is becoming conspiracy theory level stuff.

What do we know? Guy says almost certainly no overdubs. Its a cobbled together performance from numerous nights. MK was sick of. DS.

I rest my case


 

[jonboy71]

Has Guy said if there are any multitracks for any Brothers In Arms shows?  I'm hoping a show from that tour was held back for some other BIA release.

[herlock]

Has Guy said if there are any multitracks for any Brothers In Arms shows?  I'm hoping a show from that tour was held back for some other BIA release.

He said "very few"... One would be good enough!
Even if there are no multitracks, there is the PRE-FM mix for Houston, and POST-FM for Wembley, San Antonio, Cleveland, Sydney. That would be good enough... But does Guy have the rights and sources overs these shows?

[drparkinson]

Hi. A question for Chris W please (thank you for your contributions so far) regarding the OES tour.

One thing that was implied in the pre tour publicity was that the tour was expected to last longer than it did-for example two years was mentioned in the timeline in the initial tour programme: "23 AUGUST 1991 ..... SOMETIME IN 1993 - Dire Straits begin their world tour with five dates at The Point in Dublin, expecting 250-300 more to follow over the next 2 years, with  audiences adding up to maybe 7 million."

I remember some perception at the time that even though the tour was successful that perhaps DS had overestimated the demand and had to reduce the initial touring plans - for example an interview with Pete Townshend (who we know liked DS) from Musician magazine in July 93 where he talks about the change in audience demand and touring climate at the time for big bands such as the Who and the Stones and uses DS as an example "I think it was a great humiliation for Dire Straits to put aside 18 months for international touring and then find that they were only required for eight and a half weeks. Because they're as vital as they ever were" (if you want to see the full context, this is the only copy I could find online: https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/SNwAAOSwhyJjnfv-/s-l1600.jpg)

But when you look at the figures DS did end up playing to 7 million people as originally estimated, so maybe the length of the tour and number of dates were reduced when larger ticket sales were achieved by playing stadiums in the summer of 1992?

I was curious as to whether there were actually concrete plans for a 2 year tour that was then reduced or whether that timeframe was just abstract based on initial expectations?  Can you remember at the time you signed up for the tour was it for a set period (such as the dates as played) or was it more open ended?  And whether there were any dates or territories that had been discussed or pencilled in beyond the final show in October 1992 that were then dropped?  thanks!

[dmg]

In 2021 I published on my blog about this aspect of CE on OTN, I ended the article by writing: The audio is basically a tremendous edit, a lot of mixes here, a lot of audio is from Nimes FRA 21. 05.92, but a lot of other parts are a lot of unknown mixes.

I made comparisons between the OTN CL with the Audio CL of Bootlegs Nimes FRA 21.05.92 and Rotterdam, Netherlands 5/31/1992, to complement my research and reach this conclusion.

So here is some data, (a lot of audio is from Nimes FRA 21. 05.92, but a lot of other parts are a lot of unknown mixes.)

The closest versions to the CE version of OTN are Nimes FRA 21.05.92 and Rotterdam, Netherlands 5/31/1992, having these bootlegs as a starting point, just analyze and compare, it is possible to identify the licks and notice that there are licks that they were probably made in the studio, or, it was taken from some other show, but, I point out that I analyzed all the bootleg recordings from Nimes and Rotterdam in May 1992 and only the dates I mentioned above have licks and vocal performances that are on OTN, with the exception of Mark's greeting with a "hey, Alright!" at the beginning of the song, that was taken from some other show, probably Paris in April 92.


Here is the link to the article I wrote.

https://universodirestraits.blogspot.com/2021/06/calling-elvis-on-night-performance.html?m=0

There aren't bootlegs circulating of the 1st or final shows in Rotterdam so sound could come from either of these performances.

That's why I mentioned, "that there are licks that were probably made in the studio, or were taken from some other show", in this case, it could be from these two shows in Rotterdam that we don't have recordings, but that the band.

Apologies Brunno, I must've missed that part.  This has turned into a rather long discussion! 

[Brunno Nunes]

In 2021 I published on my blog about this aspect of CE on OTN, I ended the article by writing: The audio is basically a tremendous edit, a lot of mixes here, a lot of audio is from Nimes FRA 21. 05.92, but a lot of other parts are a lot of unknown mixes.

I made comparisons between the OTN CL with the Audio CL of Bootlegs Nimes FRA 21.05.92 and Rotterdam, Netherlands 5/31/1992, to complement my research and reach this conclusion.

So here is some data, (a lot of audio is from Nimes FRA 21. 05.92, but a lot of other parts are a lot of unknown mixes.)

The closest versions to the CE version of OTN are Nimes FRA 21.05.92 and Rotterdam, Netherlands 5/31/1992, having these bootlegs as a starting point, just analyze and compare, it is possible to identify the licks and notice that there are licks that they were probably made in the studio, or, it was taken from some other show, but, I point out that I analyzed all the bootleg recordings from Nimes and Rotterdam in May 1992 and only the dates I mentioned above have licks and vocal performances that are on OTN, with the exception of Mark's greeting with a "hey, Alright!" at the beginning of the song, that was taken from some other show, probably Paris in April 92.


Here is the link to the article I wrote.

https://universodirestraits.blogspot.com/2021/06/calling-elvis-on-night-performance.html?m=0

There aren't bootlegs circulating of the 1st or final shows in Rotterdam so sound could come from either of these performances.

That's why I mentioned, "that there are licks that were probably made in the studio, or were taken from some other show", in this case, it could be from these two shows in Rotterdam that we don't have recordings, but that the band.

Apologies Brunno, I must've missed that part.  This has turned into a rather long discussion! 

I know this topic is going on a lot, we can continue this debate in this exclusive topic about it, which was created this year:

https://www.amarkintime.org/forum/index.php?topic=8364.165

 

[olazabalrok]

But when you look at the figures DS did end up playing to 7 million people as originally estimated, so maybe the length of the tour and number of dates were reduced when larger ticket sales were achieved by playing stadiums in the summer of 1992?

I was curious as to whether there were actually concrete plans for a 2 year tour that was then reduced or whether that timeframe was just abstract based on initial expectations?  Can you remember at the time you signed up for the tour was it for a set period (such as the dates as played) or was it more open ended?  And whether there were any dates or territories that had been discussed or pencilled in beyond the final show in October 1992 that were then dropped?  thanks!

Wasn’t the total ticket sales more or less half of that, around 3,5 million? I think it’s been well reported that there was supposed to be a South America leg after the European shows but the plans were cancelled as everyone was so tired and it would’ve been a financial risk to do it.

[Chris W]

It really amuses and amazes me that you wont take the word of the person involved in its creation, one of the actual people in the control room during its creation.

But of course you're entitled to your opinion....

I was at least in part involved in it's creation. 20+ years ago, before this forum even existed, I was being told there was a lot of repair work done in the studio when mixing 'On The Night'.
The other fact is that 99.99% of live albums are fixed with overdubs during mix down. Why is it that in 1992 'On The Night' would be different from all other live albums?

[Chris W]

in theory yes. But in practice no.


Forgetting what Guitar you used on a song, or the particular eq settings on an amp is a totally different thing from having studio time booked at £1000 plus an hour, sitting in front of the recording desk, setting up amps, and trying to recreate said live sound. Totally different. That process wouldn't have been simple either, it would have involved several days of studio time, remember this is pre BG.

This is becoming conspiracy theory level stuff.

Finding and editing together sections of songs from different shows is more complex and takes longer than just fixing a few notes in the bass, or the guitar. So your theory about studio time is wrong.
Like I said, fixing any mistakes on a live recording is absolutely 100% standard practice in the music industry. It is counted as part of the final mix.
What every one does (and has done for decades) is record several shows (in this case 2 shows at Nimes and 2 shows at Rotterdam). Then you listen through and first choose the best overall version of each song, then you go through again and see if there are any better guitar solos, or vocal verses (for example) than the main song you have chosen. Then once all that is edited together you go through and fix any wrong bass notes, or out of tune guitar chords etc, etc...
That is how ALL live albums are made.

[Chris W]

Can you remember at the time you signed up for the tour was it for a set period (such as the dates as played) or was it more open ended?  And whether there were any dates or territories that had been discussed or pencilled in beyond the final show in October 1992 that were then dropped?  thanks!

When I signed up it was going to be just over a year on the road (not including rehearsals). The tour was planned and all musicians contracted then the first Gulf war happened. DS couldn't get international insurance due to uncertainty with security etc. So everything was postponed for six months.
I never heard about any South American leg until way after the tour had ended. We were never scheduled to tour Japan either, which I thought was strange. However the reality is, the tour was super successful by anyone's standards. The last six months we played to huge sell out crowds in outdoor stadiums across Europe. We could have easily kept going around Europe from October 92 to the end of the year, but I think Mark and John felt like they had had enough.

[Jules]

Can you remember at the time you signed up for the tour was it for a set period (such as the dates as played) or was it more open ended?  And whether there were any dates or territories that had been discussed or pencilled in beyond the final show in October 1992 that were then dropped?  thanks!

When I signed up it was going to be just over a year on the road (not including rehearsals). The tour was planned and all musicians contracted then the first Gulf war happened. DS couldn't get international insurance due to uncertainty with security etc. So everything was postponed for six months.
I never heard about any South American leg until way after the tour had ended. We were never scheduled to tour Japan either, which I thought was strange. However the reality is, the tour was super successful by anyone's standards. The last six months we played to huge sell out crowds in outdoor stadiums across Europe. We could have easily kept going around Europe from October 92 to the end of the year, but I think Mark and John felt like they had had enough.

There are pictures of a tour bus with Eastern Europe and South American included, but because of the economical situation in 1992 they decided not to do it