New DS Live Box Set, 3rd November 2023!

[herlock]

GF:

Sorry about the outro. I just thought it went on a bit, didn’t develop and I know for a fact Mark would not have wanted that.

First, you all can see that GF survived this thread, if he ever read it. He is not *that* sensitive

Then, what he is saying about the outro does not make sense. The fact that Mark wouldn't want that now does not erase the fact that he obviously wanted the song to be played that way, back in 1983. He also wouldn't want to play Sultans with keyboards anymore, for sure - should the keyboards be removed from the mix on Alchemy, then? Guy is not here to rewrite History, Stalin-style, just to document it. If some people don't like it, they can just skip it!

Besides, I seriously doubt that Mark wouldn't want that, even in modern days. Postcards from Paraguay in 2013/2015 went on forever, and was used as a platform for band introductions. It was way less interesting than the sax/guitar duel on PB, and yet it made it on the live recordings!

If Guy had just a little glimpse of fan psychology, he would never had taken such a radical decision. Oh well... Ok, let's not write another 15 pages about it...

[herlock]

As much as I loved Portobello belle in its long version live, I have to admit that I've been blinded by the frustration of not having it on full on this new box.

We really (specially me) don't have right to show that frustration on Guy as he really had gave us more than he had to. This is his work, not an obligation to fulfill fans dreams, and as we say in Spain, you can't leave the trees to hide the forest.

This box is far more than we ever dreamed about and I feel ashamed to let myself go on the frustration on not having just one song complete, not matter how much I love it, to forget how thankful I should be for everything else we are getting.

You can be both frustrated *and* thankful, as I am. Not incompatible

[wakeywakey]

GF:

Sorry about the outro. I just thought it went on a bit, didn’t develop and I know for a fact Mark would not have wanted that.

Nice of him to apologise but if MK didn't want it why the hell was it played in the first place?
It seems the buck is being passed to someone who definitely won't play so Guy must be hoping this ends the discussion.
I don't think I'll ever agree with his "reasoning" so to all who wanted more the message is:TOUGH LUCK.

[qjamesfloyd]

I for one am very happy to have anything new released under the name Dire Straits, if this is Guy's project (maybe with Mark overseeing?) then it's up to him to decide what to include, not include, edit etc, it doesn't bother me in the slightest, I have been a DS/MK fan since the late 80's so, I am always grateful for new releases, I will buy this box set, like most of us here, and I will enjoy it for what it is, the odd seconds or minutes missing here and there is ok with me. Guy has done a great job with this release, he has made himself available to the fans on his forum, which is great, he really doesn't have to.

[superval99]

I for one am very happy to have anything new released under the name Dire Straits, if this is Guy's project (maybe with Mark overseeing?) then it's up to him to decide what to include, not include, edit etc, it doesn't bother me in the slightest, I have been a DS/MK fan since the late 80's so, I am always grateful for new releases, I will buy this box set, like most of us here, and I will enjoy it for what it is, the odd seconds or minutes missing here and there is ok with me. Guy has done a great job with this release, he has made himself available to the fans on his forum, which is great, he really doesn't have to.

I feel the same as you.   I am looking forward to buying the box set too and the missing few minutes won't bother me at all.

[quizzaciously]

GF:

Sorry about the outro. I just thought it went on a bit, didn’t develop and I know for a fact Mark would not have wanted that.

Nice of him to apologise but if MK didn't want it why the hell was it played in the first place?
It seems the buck is being passed to someone who definitely won't play so Guy must be hoping this ends the discussion.
I don't think I'll ever agree with his "reasoning" so to all who wanted more the message is:TOUGH LUCK.

The strangest thing is that I always thought Mark recently has become "the king of outros". I remember being on a live show in 2019 and thinking "Man, half of the show must be just outros", some of them lasting for many minutes. And Guy stating "outro is not something Mark would want" is indeed strange.

The whole idea of this "Portobello Belle" version is simply having fun in the reggae environment akin to the "So Far Away" calypso version. It's the celebration of music, having fun on stage, enjoying funny moments and rhythms, dancing and smiling.

To cut it short again and again is simply ridiculous. If I want to listen to the short Portobello Belle, then I'll listen to the studio recording. If I want to have fun, I'll listen to the uncut performance on YouTube, don't mind it's 13 minutes.

[quizzaciously]

I think the reasons to cut Portobello are as follows. Intro: awful crowd clapping not in sync with the band (on 1 and 3 instead of 2 and 4). Then, if you cut to the sax intro omitting clapping, it's strange to start abruptly on the sax intro, so they cut straight into the verse instead.

Now, the cut of the outro is more mysterious: I think Mark was just not a fan of his guitar work there, as simple as that. And the arrangement in general.

I get the impression that they should've started with a jam, and then gone to the song, the mistake they later redeemed with "So Far Away". This way, you go from jam to the song, and it's a way nicer transition than just going for a 10-minute outro to nowhere.

Bottom line: perfectionism is a disease. Just release the full song and move on, this stuff happened 40 years ago, who cares!

[ds1984]

It is great that artist get feedback from the public.

This is not a one way relationship.

Otherwise we would  go to a concert, remain silent and just get out of the venue once the show is over.

Guy should not be put in an ivory tower.

The thing lies in "How".

How to express a dissatisfaction without turning into being disrespectfull?

If a lot of people ask for release of full unedited version of the Alchemy concert that should tell Guy something.
Unless something utterly bad happend during the performance. But the audience tapes are out and we know that this is not the case.
This is more of personnal taste of "is this good enough to put it out?'.

[herlock]

As you said nothing bad happenned during this performance.
So don't think in place of people, just release it, and let people decide whether they want to listen to it or just skip it. There is plenty of space left, even on the 6-disc vinyl ediition.
Is it that difficult ?

[jf9081]

Exact! Not to write another 15 pages... but I don't understand this last explanation either! it's a mistery! In live shows there are thousands of these connections between songs and they are often beautiful transition moments, especially in Alchemy with PB/TOL. It had to be FINALLY released in its entirety, without the personal pleasure.
Patience, let's wait for the box and enjoy the other things, which promises a lot!!

[Marnix]

Exact! Not to write another 15 pages... but I don't understand this last explanation either! it's a mistery! In live shows there are thousands of these connections between songs and they are often beautiful transition moments, especially in Alchemy with PB/TOL. It had to be FINALLY released in its entirety, without the personal pleasure.
Patience, let's wait for the box and enjoy the other things, which promises a lot!!

Totally agree!! I am looking forward to hear the 1979 show in pristine quality and also the 7(!!) extra songs from the OES tour.

[Stiglar]

I'm waiting to hear the concert in it's entirety before making too many judgements on what it should/shouldn't be ,

I do agree with guy in that , the outro of PB does go for too long and it does meander, I can understand why he/mark would feel it isn't necessary , I don't think i'll miss it too much to be honest, Especially since I felt personally that the new PB on the MFN compilation was a bit messy/raw compared to the rest of alchemy. I do wonder if when listened to/mixed in good quality if things jumped out more and it fell a bit too far into the messy/jam category of recording

Having said that ... should it be included anyway? I think so! Those tours are known for their drawn out versions and jams, just release it in it's entirety even if it's just for a digital release, I guess there are budgets and times to think about. But still. Maybe one day!

[Marnix]

The online streamingsplatforms don't mention were the On The Night bonustracks are recorded ?

My guess is if Guy took only the may shows from Nimes and Rotterdam 1992:
Fade to Black: Nimes, may 21 (only played that date)
When it comes to you: Nimes, may 19/20/21
Tunnel Of Love: Rotterdam, may 30 (only played that date)
I Think I Love You Too Much: Rotterdam, may 30 (only played that date)
Sultans of Swing and Telegraph Road are played on all the recorded shows so any date is possible

[jf9081]

I'm waiting to hear the concert in it's entirety before making too many judgements on what it should/shouldn't be ,

I do agree with guy in that , the outro of PB does go for too long and it does meander, I can understand why he/mark would feel it isn't necessary , I don't think i'll miss it too much to be honest, Especially since I felt personally that the new PB on the MFN compilation was a bit messy/raw compared to the rest of alchemy. I do wonder if when listened to/mixed in good quality if things jumped out more and it fell a bit too far into the messy/jam category of recording

Having said that ... should it be included anyway? I think so! Those tours are known for their drawn out versions and jams, just release it in it's entirety even if it's just for a digital release, I guess there are budgets and times to think about. But still. Maybe one day!

I hope for a digital release of the song in its entirety...or a new complete bluray!!

[Jules]

The online streamingsplatforms don't mention were the On The Night bonustracks are recorded ?

My guess is if Guy took only the may shows from Nimes and Rotterdam 1992:
Fade to Black: Nimes, may 21 (only played that date)
When it comes to you: Nimes, may 19/20/21
Tunnel Of Love: Rotterdam, may 30 (only played that date)
I Think I Love You Too Much: Rotterdam, may 30 (only played that date)
Sultans of Swing and Telegraph Road are played on all the recorded shows so any date is possible

I think the streaming services have the location of the songs, at least apple music. I can't see it in Amazon music as its not available yet and only shows me a part of the title and the length but can't see the location except for these ones: