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Author Topic: New DS Live Box Set, 3rd November 2023!  (Read 112889 times)

Offlinedmg

  • David Knopfler
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Re: New DS Live Box Set, 3rd November 2023!
« Reply #1140 on: December 15, 2023, 12:54:15 PM »

The man deserves praise more than he deserves criticism, and small things like the proverbial sausage story or the absence of a tour party are just not registering on my radar of appreciation. Try to do what he did, and 99.99999999% of people would fail without even starting. End of rant.

Most of what you post is guess work.
In the end I don't really care about a tour party, I just brought it up as an indication of how dysfunctional Mark was during the tour.
Whatever mood you are in, it is just common politeness to thank the 150 or so people who just helped you sell out huge outdoor stadiums, making large amounts of money for your future lifestyle.
agree.

I also agree.  I've said before that I don't think I'd like Mark as a person, certainly not in the DS days anyway.  It doesn't stop me liking his music though.

He never had a party after the BIA tour either.  You can even see him after the show running off stage, jumping into a Porsche and driving away during the broadcast.  The difference there was they had played 20 nights at the same venue in Sydney and according to Jack Sonni they had a good time windsurfing every day! 
"I'm playing all the right notes, but not necessarily in the right order."

Offlinermarques821

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Re: New DS Live Box Set, 3rd November 2023!
« Reply #1141 on: December 15, 2023, 01:20:11 PM »
It has always  felt odd that Mark overdid the BIA tour, grew fatigued with the band, and then did the same thing all over five years later. It must have snowballed out of control once he displayed willingness to resurrect the band. Many people and strong forces pushing for more shows and bigger venues, presumably...

History is history, but I always felt it could be a better idea to leave DS after BiA and make On Every Street the first solo album, how cool is that? As Chris said, a 14-month tour is an overkill, it's unhealthy and not normal. It's not normal to go on tour for so long that marriages and friendships get destroyed as a result of it as if it's some kind of war campaign and not just playing some popular music for people. It's like being overweight or being an alcoholic. A 14-month tour non-stop, come on.

I'm not sure where you got that idea. 14-month tours are completely normal and even desirable for all top bands in the World.

Offlinesuperval99

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Re: New DS Live Box Set, 3rd November 2023!
« Reply #1142 on: December 15, 2023, 01:23:38 PM »
I think Mark is a completely different person now from the DS days.   Maybe it was Kitty who changed him.   :)
Goin' into Tow Law....

Offlinequizzaciously

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Re: New DS Live Box Set, 3rd November 2023!
« Reply #1143 on: December 15, 2023, 01:28:03 PM »
It has always  felt odd that Mark overdid the BIA tour, grew fatigued with the band, and then did the same thing all over five years later. It must have snowballed out of control once he displayed willingness to resurrect the band. Many people and strong forces pushing for more shows and bigger venues, presumably...

History is history, but I always felt it could be a better idea to leave DS after BiA and make On Every Street the first solo album, how cool is that? As Chris said, a 14-month tour is an overkill, it's unhealthy and not normal. It's not normal to go on tour for so long that marriages and friendships get destroyed as a result of it as if it's some kind of war campaign and not just playing some popular music for people. It's like being overweight or being an alcoholic. A 14-month tour non-stop, come on.

I'm not sure where you got that idea. 14-month tours are completely normal and even desirable for all top bands in the World.

Okay, I start to get it. Going away from family for 1.5 years, and breaking up with wives and friends after the fact is completely normal, not partying after a tour where everybody was both exhausted and had enough fun in the process and paid well is sacrilegious. Understood.

Offlinermarques821

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Re: New DS Live Box Set, 3rd November 2023!
« Reply #1144 on: December 15, 2023, 01:37:14 PM »
It has always  felt odd that Mark overdid the BIA tour, grew fatigued with the band, and then did the same thing all over five years later. It must have snowballed out of control once he displayed willingness to resurrect the band. Many people and strong forces pushing for more shows and bigger venues, presumably...

History is history, but I always felt it could be a better idea to leave DS after BiA and make On Every Street the first solo album, how cool is that? As Chris said, a 14-month tour is an overkill, it's unhealthy and not normal. It's not normal to go on tour for so long that marriages and friendships get destroyed as a result of it as if it's some kind of war campaign and not just playing some popular music for people. It's like being overweight or being an alcoholic. A 14-month tour non-stop, come on.

I'm not sure where you got that idea. 14-month tours are completely normal and even desirable for all top bands in the World.

Okay, I start to get it. Going away from family for 1.5 years, and breaking up with wives and friends after the fact is completely normal, not partying after a tour where everybody was both exhausted and had enough fun in the process and paid well is sacrilegious. Understood.
Not really. You didn't understand the point of what I said and instead resorted to a defensive, sarcastic comment.

Offlinequizzaciously

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Re: New DS Live Box Set, 3rd November 2023!
« Reply #1145 on: December 15, 2023, 01:40:44 PM »
I think Mark is a completely different person now from the DS days.   Maybe it was Kitty who changed him.   :)

People don't change I'm afraid. Especially considering he was in his mid-40s at the time. The circumstances can change, though, and considering where MK is now (independent, successful, prolific, and still able to walk in the streets unrecognised) he's done a great job changing the circumstances. But the mind is still the same, I can guarantee it 100%. I never met anyone in my life who truly changed their personality, most are trying to fix the surroundings instead, which is a better idea in my book. Meeting the right woman who's a great match for you is the best way to change your life indeed.

Offlinesuperval99

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Re: New DS Live Box Set, 3rd November 2023!
« Reply #1146 on: December 15, 2023, 01:47:26 PM »
I think Mark is a completely different person now from the DS days.   Maybe it was Kitty who changed him.   :)

People don't change I'm afraid. Especially considering he was in his mid-40s at the time. The circumstances can change, though, and considering where MK is now (independent, successful, prolific, and still able to walk in the streets unrecognised) he's done a great job changing the circumstances. But the mind is still the same, I can guarantee it 100%. I never met anyone in my life who truly changed their life, most are trying to fix the surroundings instead, which is a better idea in my book. Meeting the right woman who's a great match for you is the best way to change your life indeed.

Yes, I'm sure he met the right woman to change his life and he certainly appears to be happier these days.    He and his other bandmembers seem to be good friends too - most of them have been with him for around 30 years and Guy even longer! 
Goin' into Tow Law....

OfflineRobson

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Re: New DS Live Box Set, 3rd November 2023!
« Reply #1147 on: December 15, 2023, 02:20:54 PM »
"Meeting the right woman who's a great match for you is the best way to change your life indeed"

That's a very nice punch line :) I'm coming back to Tunnel Of Love with On The Night. God, what a beautiful version.
I know the way I can see by the moonlight
Clear as the day
Now come on woman, come follow me home

Offlinehunter v2.0

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Re: New DS Live Box Set, 3rd November 2023!
« Reply #1148 on: December 15, 2023, 02:25:41 PM »
Hi, guys and gals. Me hunter :) I didn't plan to return; it's nice out there, off SoMe. But I just had to:

@Quizzaciously: Can you just stop already? The rants and conjecturing and stuff? It is painful to read. And FYI: People do change.

Offlinewakeywakey

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Re: New DS Live Box Set, 3rd November 2023!
« Reply #1149 on: December 15, 2023, 03:24:37 PM »
Welcome back Hunter.
I hope 2.0 is a vast improvement :lol

OfflineRobson

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Re: New DS Live Box Set, 3rd November 2023!
« Reply #1150 on: December 15, 2023, 03:36:00 PM »
Hi, guys and gals. Me hunter :) I didn't plan to return; it's nice out there, off SoMe. But I just had to:

@Quizzaciously: Can you just stop already? The rants and conjecturing and stuff? It is painful to read. And FYI: People do change.

For me it is not painful. Contrary  :)
I know the way I can see by the moonlight
Clear as the day
Now come on woman, come follow me home

Offlinequizzaciously

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Re: New DS Live Box Set, 3rd November 2023!
« Reply #1151 on: December 15, 2023, 03:44:17 PM »
Hi, guys and gals. Me hunter :) I didn't plan to return; it's nice out there, off SoMe. But I just had to:

@Quizzaciously: Can you just stop already? The rants and conjecturing and stuff? It is painful to read. And FYI: People do change.

Then prove me wrong instead of attacking me personally and telling me what to do. On this forum, I've been a target for such attacks for a long time, and even left AMIT because of that, other people left the forum because of that, and then I returned, and I see you return. And now I'm enjoying the marvellous attempts of Chris Whitten to call me an idiot without actually doing so. But it's not how discussion works, you see.

If people DO change, why has nobody on this forum ever changed? I've been a regular visitor and contributor here for more than a decade maybe, and nobody ever changed here either. You can take a 10-year-old post from a user and see no real change. If people do change, why does Mark keep telling the same things in interviews over and over for 40 years now? Give me examples, give me thoughts, give me analysis, not a middle finger.

Offlineborder_reiver

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Re: New DS Live Box Set, 3rd November 2023!
« Reply #1152 on: December 15, 2023, 04:16:02 PM »
Now, now gentlemen.

I've enjoyed this thread immensely since the start of it. Let's keep it that way.  :)
"My idea of heaven is a place where the Tyne meets the Delta, where folk music meets the blues."

Offlinequizzaciously

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Re: New DS Live Box Set, 3rd November 2023!
« Reply #1153 on: December 15, 2023, 04:26:01 PM »
The point is that you can just as easily flip these things around. You claim he did everything right. Maybe he did everything wrong? As you said, it's all guesswork, and there's no reason why the guesses should be in one direction or the other. GIven what we know, I think it's pretty safe to say that there were plenty of mistakes made. It might not have been a good idea to tour at all, in the long run. But, it would be weird if they didn't make any good moves, either.

I should also add that the OES tour wasn't all that long compared to what many other artists do. Proof: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_highest-grossing_concert_tours - so no need to exaggerate the fact that it was 14 months long (+ prep). It's actually quite common.

Maybe you live in a different country,  but around here, we have many people leave their families for a few weeks at the time to go work offshore. I have yet to hear of this being an issue, simply because everything is carefully planned and the whole concept and it's potential issues (i.e. related to personal relations) are reasonably well understood. Just as you would imagine MK & crew would plan the OES tour properly, and be well aware of their own experience from the BIA tour and also the tours done by other artists (pretty sure MK is friends with some of those and would have been able to ask for advice if needed). If this indeed took it's toll on some personal relations, then that's because of bad decisions being made (at least in hindsight).

"...and things snowballed out of control." - Well, who's in charge of that, if it's true? MK, no?

That's a good question. I guess you can control a snowball, but you can't be in charge of an avalanche when it happens. You just accept it and prevent it from happening again if you get lucky enough to survive. I mean a man like MK can potentially have control over many things, but there are also financial, contractual, and psychological obligations, physical limitations, build-up of obligations, emotions, fatigue, problems with private life, family, and a million different factors.

That's why I'm trying to say MK is a human after all, and yes, mistakes are what make us humans, but it's how you react to mistakes and deal with them later on that matters. Judging by the fact we haven't heard anything from Dire Straits from 1993 (live at the BBC album released to please the contract doesn't count), and the fact the titular hero of this forum barely returns to this band in any shape or form, and that everyone agrees it's likely gone for good, he doesn't want this avalanche to repeat.

As for long tours, I still don't think it's a good idea to tour for so long. Why not do fewer shows or tours, and just spread it across a longer period? Like Bob Dylan, like Van Morrison. Mark got stuck in the album-tour formula and it's one of the major reasons he stopped touring now I think, apart from health and other concerns. Because if he releases an album, he needs to tour with as many shows as possible, it's what he has been doing for all his artistic life. Album, tour, album, tour, album, tour. And the tour has to be big because kids these days can't do it, but Mark sure can.

Sting expressed similar feelings towards large-scale tours of The Police. Marriages breaking down, tension building and spilling over the top, and band members barely surviving the experience themselves. It's all a build-up of a lot of things, I don't think anyone has ever dreamed about doing 365 shows a year. Music is not a sport, but damn, it feels like it sometimes is a sport with all this "who's bigger" attitude and measurements of revenue figures, managers and hunger for money.

Offlinehunter v2.0

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Re: New DS Live Box Set, 3rd November 2023!
« Reply #1154 on: December 15, 2023, 05:04:05 PM »
Jesus, Mary and Joseph  ::)

 

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