Dortmund 1980

[dmg]

I prefer the Boston '80 concert from this era, however it's not my favourite era.  I think a lot of the experimental exercises didn't really work out too well, especially in Lions which just sounded awful.  On and on with no direction whatsoever becoming louder and more boring with it.  TOL nearly always went out of tune at the end!  OUATItW was just average with no real soloing.  I prefer the simplicity of the '79 versions or the extended 1982-83 versions.  Most of these tunes were better in earlier or later tours IMHO.  The only highlight from this tour was Skateaway.  More an interesting tour than a great tour for me.

[herlock]

I prefer the Boston '80 concert from this era, however it's not my favourite era.  I think a lot of the experimental exercises didn't really work out too well, especially in Lions which just sounded awful.  On and on with no direction whatsoever becoming louder and more boring with it.  TOL nearly always went out of tune at the end!  OUATItW was just average with no real soloing.  I prefer the simplicity of the '79 versions or the extended 1982-83 versions.  Most of these tunes were better in earlier or later tours IMHO.  The only highlight from this tour was Skateaway.  More an interesting tour than a great tour for me.

Quite a fantastic tour for me:
1) Very balanced setlist, all first 3 albums very well represented, Telegraph Road in advance !
2) Very interesting arrangements of old songs. For Lions, I agree that the end solo was boring, it was better and rawer in 78/79. But the core of the song was great, with the more dynamic rythm ! And News was even better, very touching with synth and Hammond organ. Quite unique ! And what about WDYTYG with the extra guitar solo in the middle ? I thought you liked this one better than the 79 versions, dmg ?

[dmg]

I prefer the Boston '80 concert from this era, however it's not my favourite era.  I think a lot of the experimental exercises didn't really work out too well, especially in Lions which just sounded awful.  On and on with no direction whatsoever becoming louder and more boring with it.  TOL nearly always went out of tune at the end!  OUATItW was just average with no real soloing.  I prefer the simplicity of the '79 versions or the extended 1982-83 versions.  Most of these tunes were better in earlier or later tours IMHO.  The only highlight from this tour was Skateaway.  More an interesting tour than a great tour for me.

Quite a fantastic tour for me:
1) Very balanced setlist, all first 3 albums very well represented, Telegraph Road in advance !
2) Very interesting arrangements of old songs. For Lions, I agree that the end solo was boring, it was better and rawer in 78/79. But the core of the song was great, with the more dynamic rythm ! And News was even better, very touching with synth and Hammond organ. Quite unique ! And what about WDYTYG with the extra guitar solo in the middle ? I thought you liked this one better than the 79 versions, dmg ?

Yes, WDYTYG was very fine indeed.   

[JF]

I prefer the simplicity of the '79 versions or the extended 1982-83 versions.

yes. as Jeroen says in his comments on most concerts of this tour : "the missing leink between the raw 4 pieces early band and the almost prog-extended-super-groupe from Alchemy era

I like expermientation, but I agree with you that it's not always tastefull.

I really like Angel of mercy with the band presentation, and the jazzy-feel in the verses

[ds1984]

This is probably the tour I miss the most.

[Love Expresso]

I prefer the Boston '80 concert from this era, however it's not my favourite era.  I think a lot of the experimental exercises didn't really work out too well, especially in Lions which just sounded awful.  On and on with no direction whatsoever becoming louder and more boring with it.  TOL nearly always went out of tune at the end!  OUATItW was just average with no real soloing.  I prefer the simplicity of the '79 versions or the extended 1982-83 versions.  Most of these tunes were better in earlier or later tours IMHO.  The only highlight from this tour was Skateaway.  More an interesting tour than a great tour for me.

Totally agree and well put. They were totally overpowering and Mark seems drunk on almost all I saw from this era..

Lots of energy can be good at times and nowadays I wish he would put some more into "showing off", but at those days most of it was musically very ambitious but just ... too much.

LE

[herlock]

I prefer the Boston '80 concert from this era, however it's not my favourite era.  I think a lot of the experimental exercises didn't really work out too well, especially in Lions which just sounded awful.  On and on with no direction whatsoever becoming louder and more boring with it.  TOL nearly always went out of tune at the end!  OUATItW was just average with no real soloing.  I prefer the simplicity of the '79 versions or the extended 1982-83 versions.  Most of these tunes were better in earlier or later tours IMHO.  The only highlight from this tour was Skateaway.  More an interesting tour than a great tour for me.

Totally agree and well put. They were totally overpowering and Mark seems drunk on almost all I saw from this era..

Lots of energy can be good at times and nowadays I wish he would put some more into "showing off", but at those days most of it was musically very ambitious but just ... too much.

LE

I think it all goes down to: do  you appreciate keyboard addition to songs that weren't not meant for keyboards in the first place ?
I have mixed feelings about this.

On the one hand, keyboards in the OL tour sounded really crude. They sounded much better latter in the LOG tour; in the BIA tour they sounded too much, overused at any rate. In the OES tour they were almost absent, burried in Paul Franklin's pedal steel guitar which was taken way too much space.
Also, we can argue that simple, raw 4-piece songs were much better and cleaner in the orignal form. Mark ended getting rid of keyboards and sax on Sultans after all.

On the other hand, some songs were really enhanced in the OL tour in a way that my ears like, but some were just butchered. If I take them one by one:
- News: best example of sucessful transformation. The song sound so much better with Hammond organ and progression chords. So epic, so emotional ! On the album it sounds dull and try in comparaison. Rockpalast'79 is a bit better because a bit more dynamic, I like it, but still, so much emotion in '81 were the song was dedicated to John Lennon (and later to Bob Marley).
- Lions: ok I agree with dmg that the end solo is going nowhere and was better raw in 78/79; but the change of rythm, making it more dynamic, is awesome.
- WDYTYG: I hate the keyboards additions (so crude) and the end solo is slower than in 79, which  I don't like, *BUT* they are a pretext to introduce a "crying" mid solo, which is awesome. So I love it
- DTTW: I don't like 80 versions, I think the keyboards are a poor subsitute to David's guitar groove. Hal's guitar is no match to David's, the song sounds duller witout him. Still, the very last versions (last 2 weeks of tour) added a piano solo towards the end which revitalize it - great !
- Angel of Mercy: totally reworked song with Piano, I love it ! so different.
- Single Handed Sailor and In the Gallery: the ones I don't like, totally out of place, the songs are ruined, I understand why they were dropped after this.
- Portobelle Belle: just a more rocking version than the album, but less touching than the reworked version of 82/83. Hal's guitar is just out of place.
- Wild West End: some piano but not extraordinary. I prefer the original...
 

[Brunno Nunes- (Universo Dire Straits)]

I prefer the Boston '80 concert from this era, however it's not my favourite era.  I think a lot of the experimental exercises didn't really work out too well, especially in Lions which just sounded awful.  On and on with no direction whatsoever becoming louder and more boring with it.  TOL nearly always went out of tune at the end!  OUATItW was just average with no real soloing.  I prefer the simplicity of the '79 versions or the extended 1982-83 versions.  Most of these tunes were better in earlier or later tours IMHO.  The only highlight from this tour was Skateaway.  More an interesting tour than a great tour for me.

Totally agree and well put. They were totally overpowering and Mark seems drunk on almost all I saw from this era..

Lots of energy can be good at times and nowadays I wish he would put some more into "showing off", but at those days most of it was musically very ambitious but just ... too much.

LE

I think it all goes down to: do  you appreciate keyboard addition to songs that weren't not meant for keyboards in the first place ?
I have mixed feelings about this.

On the one hand, keyboards in the OL tour sounded really crude. They sounded much better latter in the LOG tour; in the BIA tour they sounded too much, overused at any rate. In the OES tour they were almost absent, burried in Paul Franklin's pedal steel guitar which was taken way too much space.
Also, we can argue that simple, raw 4-piece songs were much better and cleaner in the orignal form. Mark ended getting rid of keyboards and sax on Sultans after all.

On the other hand, some songs were really enhanced in the OL tour in a way that my ears like, but some were just butchered. If I take them one by one:
- News: best example of sucessful transformation. The song sound so much better with Hammond organ and progression chords. So epic, so emotional ! On the album it sounds dull and try in comparaison. Rockpalast'79 is a bit better because a bit more dynamic, I like it, but still, so much emotion in '81 were the song was dedicated to John Lennon (and later to Bob Marley).
- Lions: ok I agree with dmg that the end solo is going nowhere and was better raw in 78/79; but the change of rythm, making it more dynamic, is awesome.
- WDYTYG: I hate the keyboards additions (so crude) and the end solo is slower than in 79, which  I don't like, *BUT* they are a pretext to introduce a "crying" mid solo, which is awesome. So I love it
- DTTW: I don't like 80 versions, I think the keyboards are a poor subsitute to David's guitar groove. Hal's guitar is no match to David's, the song sounds duller witout him. Still, the very last versions (last 2 weeks of tour) added a piano solo towards the end which revitalize it - great !
- Angel of Mercy: totally reworked song with Piano, I love it ! so different.
- Single Handed Sailor and In the Gallery: the ones I don't like, totally out of place, the songs are ruined, I understand why they were dropped after this.
- Portobelle Belle: just a more rocking version than the album, but less touching than the reworked version of 82/83. Hal's guitar is just out of place.
- Wild West End: some piano but not extraordinary. I prefer the original...

I agree with almost everything that was said here, I have the mixed feelings about it.
100% of acrodo with (- DTTW: I do not like 80 versions, I think the keyboards are a poor subsitute to David's guitar groove. Hal's guitar is no match for David's, the song sounds duller witout him. versions (last 2 weeks of tour) added a piano solo towards the end which revitalize it - great!
- Angel of Mercy: totally reworked song with Piano, I love it! so different.)

I find the piano sound very nice in the Lions version of the Boston bootleg 80, just at the moment after MK sings "I'm thinking about Lions ...", to feel the Alan chord with a lot of presence, something more common in 81, since the hammond organ were more exploited in 80.


One thing I've always noticed is about Knopfler's voice on this tour, it sounds different from every other tour, just repair Rockpalast 79 and Dortmund, Boston 79 or Werchter Festival 81. LOG tour and BIA tour the voice sounds the same, I will not compare with the voice in the OES tour, since they are 5 years that separate. Anyway, it's just a little detail I usually watch.

[herlock]

Actually for Lions I think I too prefer 80 to 81 versions.
In 80 you have a direct jump from DTTW to Lions, with a great continuity between the two.
In 81 Mark added a soft intro, starting with "church bells" sound FX, probably to echo to the lyrics, and continuing with a short and soft keyboard version of the main theme. Not sure if this is useful, that breaks the rythm; also, in 81 the guitar is softer, as if Mark had remorses to have shaken the song so much, and wanted to back to 79 style. A bit strange...
Dortmund video of DDTW/Lions link is perfect to my taste.

[Jules]

That tour is like the missing link between DS the promise and DS the stars...

[knopflertom]

Totally agree and well put. They were totally overpowering and Mark seems drunk on almost all I saw from this era..

LE
[/quote]

Hmm I haven't recognised in any video of DS that MK was drunk during performances. Maybe I'm too blue-eyed. I like to see where did you find this.

Thanks

Thomas

[Stiglar]

Totally agree and well put. They were totally overpowering and Mark seems drunk on almost all I saw from this era..

LE

Hmm I haven't recognised in any video of DS that MK was drunk during performances. Maybe I'm too blue-eyed. I like to see where did you find this.

Thanks

Thomas
[/quote]

Pure speculation of course but there's a particular audio bootleg (I'm sure someone will chime in with the location I can't quite remember) Where mark is slurring and seems pretty drunk, They play a disco jam from memory.

The tour is an interesting one very experimental and as lots have said sort of like the "missing link" between the old and new DS. One thing is for sure they definitely had it perfected by the time alchemy came out!

[ybot]

When was the first time they played the SOS changed outro? The extended live versions

[JF]

When was the first time they played the SOS changed outro? The extended live versions

at the end of 79, the outro solo was longer than in 78-79, but without slow pace

at the start of the 80-81 tour, they played the extended outro with the slow pace