Help wanted re figuring out the music

[kbreen]

Wondering if anyone can help me here? I am wanting to find out the "instrumentation" of a couple of songs, i.e. more than just the chords or the guitar notes, and also more than just the piano reductions. For songs such as Telegraph Rd, Brothers in Arms, Planet of New Orleans and You and Your Friend, I would like to find out what the background sounds are, e.g. what "instruments" on the synthesiser, and what the quiet background notes/chords are. I haven't been able to find out yet whether there are any MIDI recordings that cover that side of it (and have been told that none of the existing sheet music goes into anything like that kind of detail).

[kbreen]

Additional note: even just roughly what instrument "groups" might be used on the synthesiser for those kinds of background sound effects. I know nothing about synthesisers or digital music you see

[kbreen]

A further explanation (following a discussion in the Silvertown Blues forum): I'm not concerned about replicating Dire Straits exactly - it's more that I'm looking to use their background sounds as a starting point/example, for trying writing music myself.

[2manyguitars]

As a fellow musician and long time songwriter my advice would be to invest in a decent synth, or softsynth (Spectrasonics Omnisphere springs to mind). Then simply explore.

As for original DS sounds I'm sure there are people better qualified than me to give you specifics but I do know lots of the live sounds came from Jupiter 8s, Prophet 5s, Yamaha DX series, and of course, the Synclaiver. Incidentally there are some excellent software emulations of some of these classic synths available.

[quizzaciously]

2manyguitars is right!

Also, your problem is not a unique one, I desperately wanted to find any source of information on this topic for years without any luck. And natural thing to do in this situation is to do all by yourself. Train your ear, find right gear, try, try, try, try for thousand times and on 1001st time you eventually will get the right sound. Or better yet — your own sound.

[kbreen]

2manyguitars is right!

Also, your problem is not a unique one, I desperately wanted to find any source of information on this topic for years without any luck. And natural thing to do in this situation is to do all by yourself. Train your ear, find right gear, try, try, try, try for thousand times and on 1001st time you eventually will get the right sound. Or better yet — your own sound.

As I was saying though in one of my comments adding to my post: concern here is not to precisely emulate the sounds, but just to try to find someone more "in the know" than me who can give some approximation as to where to start, to narrow things down

[kbreen]

As a fellow musician and long time songwriter my advice would be to invest in a decent synth, or softsynth (Spectrasonics Omnisphere springs to mind). Then simply explore.

As for original DS sounds I'm sure there are people better qualified than me to give you specifics but I do know lots of the live sounds came from Jupiter 8s, Prophet 5s, Yamaha DX series, and of course, the Synclaiver. Incidentally there are some excellent software emulations of some of these classic synths available.

Thanks A week ago I downloaded the free trial versions of the software programmes "Ableton" and "FL" (fruity loop). That's what lead to my question here So do you know, would either of those software programmes include any of the classic synths among their instruments? If not, do you have rough kind of idea of what kinds of settings on the synths (such as instrument groups) would be used as the background sounds for those kinds of songs?

[2manyguitars]

Fruity loops and Ableton will have some synth sounds onboard, in my opinion you would be better off seeking out something like the classic synth emulations by Artuira. Spectrasonics Atmosphere or Omnisphere are both also excellent, in fact they really changed my opinion regarding synths, they replicate classic sounds and also have some brilliant 'natural' sounds. Both are simply superb tools in terms of sound design. If you're looking for something a bit simpler you could try Absynth  which is unusual and creates new sounds from old at the click of a button.

The background sounds you're looking for can come from a range of instrument types. Try experimenting with pads, strings, etc. Or if you can get yourself a soft synth with sampling capabilities you can use literally anything to design your own sounds.  Hope we're helping somewhat 

[kbreen]

Fruity loops and Ableton will have some synth sounds onboard, in my opinion you would be better off seeking out something like the classic synth emulations by Artuira. Spectrasonics Atmosphere or Omnisphere are both also excellent, in fact they really changed my opinion regarding synths, they replicate classic sounds and also have some brilliant 'natural' sounds. Both are simply superb tools in terms of sound design. If you're looking for something a bit simpler you could try Absynth  which is unusual and creates new sounds from old at the click of a button.

The background sounds you're looking for can come from a range of instrument types. Try experimenting with pads, strings, etc. Or if you can get yourself a soft synth with sampling capabilities you can use literally anything to design your own sounds.  Hope we're helping somewhat 

Thanks Do you know whether Arturia or Spectrasonics have any free trial or demo downloads? I looked on their websites, but don't know if there might be somewhere on their website that I missed? Also do you know whether synths can be any good to buy second hand, or is a product that's a bit risky second hand?

[kbreen]

I have had a quick look at 911tabs.com , and through that, found jellynotes.com . What I am looking for is sheet music that indicates what notes are played on synths (as opposed to guitars or wind instruments), and that show not just the main chords/melodies/harmonies for a song, but also the notes/chords of the quiet background music played by the synths in songs such as Telegraph Road, Private Investigations, Brothers In Arms, Planet Of New Orleans, You And Your Friend etc. Have any of you searched before, and found that kind of sheet music?

[kbreen]

Fruity loops and Ableton will have some synth sounds onboard, in my opinion you would be better off seeking out something like the classic synth emulations by Artuira. Spectrasonics Atmosphere or Omnisphere are both also excellent, in fact they really changed my opinion regarding synths, they replicate classic sounds and also have some brilliant 'natural' sounds. Both are simply superb tools in terms of sound design. If you're looking for something a bit simpler you could try Absynth  which is unusual and creates new sounds from old at the click of a button.

The background sounds you're looking for can come from a range of instrument types. Try experimenting with pads, strings, etc. Or if you can get yourself a soft synth with sampling capabilities you can use literally anything to design your own sounds.  Hope we're helping somewhat 

I'd also meant to ask: what advantages do Asturia and Spectrasonics have over Absynth?

[2manyguitars]

That's a hard question to answer. Each is different, and each has different uses. Some would say that things like Absynth are only good for dance music, while the Spectrasonics stuff is more geared towards sound design. I don't look at it that way. They are all just like having different pallets at your fingertips, its all a matter of taste.

I run a reasonably well equipped studio in a special needs school and besides the software mentioned I have access to a range of soft synths, probably about 15 or so different bits of software, and lots of vintage outboard gear I've collected over time. When I'm recording my own tracks, or my students we tend to experiment with 3 or 4 different synths, and just go with what feels right for the song or tune in question - As MK himself says, the song is king. If its not working leave it, come back and try again later. Learn your software inside out, push some buttons, turn some dials, draw some waveforms and see what happens!

With regards to sheet music for specific DS parts, I've not come across anything particularly detailed, but it might be worth considering looking into things like drones (which feature quite a bit).

Ultimately I'd encourage you to develop your own sounds, as a DS/MK fan your influences will come through naturally without trying to copy or force anything - I learnt that the hard way and it took me a long time to stop emulating and start creating.

Sorry for the long reply, I'm very passionate when it comes to music!

[kbreen]

The emulation thing would only be short-term for me. How the idea came about: I had asked in facebook songwriting groups for suggestions as to how to get started with songwriting or finding people to jam with, and a couple of people suggested the software programmes, so as a result of that suggestion I thought maybe instead of starting with writing melodies, I could start with experimenting with the kinds of "haunting" sounds of some Dire Straits songs..... just to make a start, not with the idea of even making it into a song at this stage