DS on The Tube - again

[dmg]

kay, but just on thos two london shows? or all tour, and did he just swap for the oz shows?

On the video from Toronto July 85 he's using it, yet earlier in the month at Wembley he isn't so he probably swapped when they crossed the Atlantic for the North American leg.

[Jackal]

Maybe he got it in the US during the BIA tour?

[dmg]

Maybe he got it in the US during the BIA tour?

I often thought he had ordered it, then picked it up at Rudy's on the way to the first gig, then used it for the rest of the tour.

[JF]

In most cases I'd prefer an 'early' gig of a tour. When you're watching/listening The Final Oz you see a band which is tired.  Same for the OES-tour.  The early ones from 1991 are far better than the ones from september 1992.  Seemed that MK&Co were completely bored during the last part of the OES-tour.  It became more a 'music-factory'. It lacked the freshness of the first part of the tour.

Right, but on the over hand, 'late' gigs of a tour are musically more evolved.
e.g. Portobello belle during LOG tour was far better in June 83 than in december 82 at Wembley

So it's hard to choose between a "fresh but not completely "resulted" gig" and a "more musically developped but (sometimes)"routine" gig"

[JF]

Maybe he got it in the US during the BIA tour?

I often thought he had ordered it, then picked it up at Rudy's on the way to the first gig, then used it for the rest of the tour.

yes, it seems the most likely to me

[Jackal]

[quote author=Jean-Fran

[dmg]

Well Alchemy was one of the last concerts and OTN was May when the tour finished October, so no conclusions here!

It is interesting to note, however that they never committed to any live radio soundboards until the Woburn Abbey gig on 20.06.92 when the tour started on 23.08.91...

[herlock]

Oh man, that pic of a computer guy is hilarious!!
Guy looked cool too imho, but MK's trousers look like builders' overalls.

Btw, for me Alchemy is definitely much much better than any 85 show (in fact it's the best pieces of music for me ever). 85 shows lack the special energy combined with "innovativeness". It is best heard in the after summer bootlegs where the band is starting to get worn out a bit and bored.  Eg TOL can have 19-22 minutes, but the part they added doesn't have any special solo, and imho is needless.

The break is nice thought (it is abbridged in the Wembley 85 video, no band intro but the special piano licks with the images of the wheel and the fair are very nice IHMO, something Alchemy is missing); the solo is actually 30 seconds longer than Alchemy, a bit more sophisticated; the guitar is a bit softened (overdriven), and the backing vocals add a bit to it (albeith a bit cheesy).
All in all I rate TOL 19/20 in Wembley 85 and 18/20 in Alchemy. Both are excellent, I guess it is a matter of taste. I would love to have Wembley'85 on Bluray thought, too bad only Alchemy received this VIP treatment.

[boboDS]

the solo is actually 30 seconds longer than Alchemy, a bit more sophisticated; the guitar is a bit softened (overdriven), and the backing vocals add a bit to it (albeith a bit cheesy).
All in all I rate TOL 19/20 in Wembley 85 and 18/20 in Alchemy. Both are excellent, I guess it is a matter of taste. I would love to have Wembley'85 on Bluray thought, too bad only Alchemy received this VIP treatment.

All the things you mentioned are excatly the reason for me that I don't consider it to be as perfect as aLchemy  Yeah a matter of taste. For me the score would be aLchemy 25/20, any other show maximum 19/20 

[herlock]

All the things you mentioned are excatly the reason for me that I don't consider it to be as perfect as aLchemy  Yeah a matter of taste. For me the score would be aLchemy 25/20, any other show maximum 19/20 

Well... actually some people say Sydney'86 is the best, and I totally disagree; I find it much less attractive than Wembley'85. The guitar tone is strange, and Mark does so many variations in the end solo that you really wonder what he is aiming at; I prefer Alchemy, more straightforward. And the intro in Alchemy is longer, with that nice saxophone by Mel Collins, instead of starting abruptly with the (overdriven to death) drums in Wembley; but one thing I think Wembley wins over Alchemy is the touching ambiant track (probably gu's synth) which is nicely blending with Alan's piano, just before Mark talks about the spanish city and stuff; no such ambiant track in Alchemy (Guy was not there !), which sounds a bit dry and less emotional in comparison. What do you think ?

[dmg]

To be honest I would rather listen to ToL from the MM tour than Alchemy, but much prefer the BIA tour versions.  Reasons?  Well, I love how the song bursts into life with the drums and sax followed by Marks nice powerful solo.  I also like how he introduces the band, playing different parts of other tunes.  Great stuff!  But what I like most is how the song slows down and then Mark so brilliantly builds it up again into a rousing finale.  The BIA tour versions are best at this without any doubt;  the final solos are longer and build up more slowly.  There is no doubt a musical name for this but I'm not musically informed - sorry.  I think arpeggio is the proper name for the twiddly bits on Sultans but that's about it!

Why MM tour over Alchemy?  Well, BIA versions are just perfect for me but if I want a stripped down version then MM tour versions will do very nicely.  Alchemy is neither one thing or the other;  not quite right and massively overrated.

[herlock]

Alchemy is neither one thing or the other;  not quite right and massively overrated.

I understand your point of view, I also prefer Wembley over Alchemy, but objectively, they are both excellent stuff; "massively overrated" sounds massively harsh to me Cheers

[ds1984]

All the things you mentioned are excatly the reason for me that I don't consider it to be as perfect as aLchemy  Yeah a matter of taste. For me the score would be aLchemy 25/20, any other show maximum 19/20 

Well... actually some people say Sydney'86 is the best

I like the 85 version very much. The 86 shortend has something special that the 85 hasn't.

[superval99]

But what I like most is how the song slows down and then Mark so brilliantly builds it up again into a rousing finale.  There is no doubt a musical name for this but I'm not musically informed - sorry. .

Crescendo?     

[dmg]

But what I like most is how the song slows down and then Mark so brilliantly builds it up again into a rousing finale.  There is no doubt a musical name for this but I'm not musically informed - sorry. .

Crescendo?     

Isn't that just building the music up to a rousing finale, like Speedway?  I meant a word meaning slowing it down, then building it up again.