A Mark In Time
Mark Knopfler Discussion => Mark Knopfler Discussion Forum => Topic started by: the visitor on February 01, 2025, 01:33:20 AM
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Found a link to this tune from 1987 feat. a lot of the BIA tour line up, minus Jack, Guy and Mark but including John, Terry, Chris White, Alan and additionally Phil Palmer plus a supporting others.
Not sure what the background to this tune is but recall it gets a mention in the Myles Palamer book. Always was interested in the in between time from end of BIA tour to OES and what might have been.
Listen here
https://m.soundcloud.com/user-407385081-377594150/ml10-from-dj-mix-1987
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(https://i.discogs.com/5Jgq0YbpW8Eigx7Iau5WpHIjMoZNP-3OjG-4akK9fes/rs:fit/g:sm/q:90/h:442/w:450/czM6Ly9kaXNjb2dz/LWRhdGFiYXNlLWlt/YWdlcy9SLTIxOTgy/NTgtMTI2OTMzMzAw/Mi5qcGVn.jpeg)
(https://i.discogs.com/Cd-38kWcJ6XjHflCzGnnSoKbBo77VI9YdI_PgXQqFAs/rs:fit/g:sm/q:90/h:600/w:587/czM6Ly9kaXNjb2dz/LWRhdGFiYXNlLWlt/YWdlcy9SLTIxOTgy/NTgtMTcxNDg1MzEw/My0yMzQ2LmpwZWc.jpeg)
(https://i.discogs.com/nZwPaZNGp--qqjc43plobShJOGs-xwQmdjCqGmkigAA/rs:fit/g:sm/q:90/h:600/w:597/czM6Ly9kaXNjb2dz/LWRhdGFiYXNlLWlt/YWdlcy9SLTIxOTgy/NTgtMTcxNDg1MzEw/OC0zMzk1LmpwZWc.jpeg)
(https://i.discogs.com/PjkcI5AxfTXa9jVw3LtNf575Z6QcG_lX4Hlzt5zNmVE/rs:fit/g:sm/q:90/h:600/w:593/czM6Ly9kaXNjb2dz/LWRhdGFiYXNlLWlt/YWdlcy9SLTIxOTgy/NTgtMTcxNDg1MzEx/Mi05MDkyLmpwZWc.jpeg)
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An odd release.
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The Man with the Golden Arm is an old 1950s B&W film noir.
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I wonder what the purpose was or why John chose K Wallis B? It’s also mentioned in the blurb in the OES tour programme.
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A vanity project if there ever was one.
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Wonder if Ed was involved :wave
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Wonder if Ed was involved :wave
The following post is from the man himself!
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Here’s the brief background.
In 1962 original bass player Jet Harris left the Shadows to go solo , following original drummer Tony Meehan who by that time was a producer at Decca ( who signed Jet).
They decided to team up again musically and Jerry Lordan who had written Apache, Wonderful Land and Atlantis for the Shads gave them Diamonds to record which became their third UK hit and their first number one.
Jimmy Page played rhythm and John Paul Jones played bass.
When John Illsley was recording Glass ( I may have the chronology slightly wrong) we had a brief conversation about doing an instrumental bass “associated “ track and I think I suggested a cover of Diamonds which John knew ( any guitarist or bass player who had grown up in the Sixties would have done. ).
Jet had also had a prior hit with Man With the Golden Arm ( heroin ref / Frank Sinatra starred) so that got done as well.
K Wallis B was the name of a beat group I’d briefly played in mid sixties in Yorkshire so I suggested that as a name.
So yes it was a vanity project and yes it was my fault and it sold less than Glass !
That dance mix is atrocious - no idea who did that.
Really it was just a bit of self indulgent fun - nothing more.
I don’t think anybody got paid anything.
It’s worth listening to the originals on You Tube since all the bands Mark and I played in around Leeds would have covered both ( and virtually all the Shadows repertoire. ).
It’s odd how instrumentals went from being incredibly popular to unheard now.
Hope that is of help.
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Dusty back again with some UK chart trivia:
The first number one single of 1963 was Bachelor Boy by Cliff Richard and The Shadows
The second number one single of 1963 was Dance On" by The Shadows
The third number one single of 1963 was Diamonds by Jet Harris and Tony Meehan
So Cliff and The Shad's were kind of dominating the UK charts at that point... but there were rumblings from the North West :)
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Here’s the brief background.
In 1962 original bass player Jet Harris left the Shadows to go solo , following original drummer Tony Meehan who by that time was a producer at Decca ( who signed Jet).
They decided to team up again musically and Jerry Lordan who had written Apache, Wonderful Land and Atlantis for the Shads gave them Diamonds to record which became their third UK hit and their first number one.
Jimmy Page played rhythm and John Paul Jones played bass.
When John Illsley was recording Glass ( I may have the chronology slightly wrong) we had a brief conversation about doing an instrumental bass “associated “ track and I think I suggested a cover of Diamonds which John knew ( any guitarist or bass player who had grown up in the Sixties would have done. ).
Jet had also had a prior hit with Man With the Golden Arm ( heroin ref / Frank Sinatra starred) so that got done as well.
K Wallis B was the name of a beat group I’d briefly played in mid sixties in Yorkshire so I suggested that as a name.
So yes it was a vanity project and yes it was my fault and it sold less than Glass !
That dance mix is atrocious - no idea who did that.
Really it was just a bit of self indulgent fun - nothing more.
I don’t think anybody got paid anything.
It’s worth listening to the originals on You Tube since all the bands Mark and I played in around Leeds would have covered both ( and virtually all the Shadows repertoire. ).
It’s odd how instrumentals went from being incredibly popular to unheard now.
Hope that is of help.
Fantastic Ed, thanks for the info, always wondered what this one was about. I don't own a copy so haven't heard anything other than the Dance version. Look forward to hearing the original when I find it.
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Ed implying that "Glass" sold not too well, makes me even more proud to own a vinyl copy of it which I bought in our little (Northern German small town) record store in the year of release.
LE
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Ed implying that "Glass" sold not too well, makes me even more proud to own a vinyl copy of it which I bought in our little (Northern German small town) record store in the year of release.
LE
You are proud that you own a terrible record that was only released so the record company could indulge the bass player in their biggest cash cow at the time? ;)
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Ed implying that "Glass" sold not too well, makes me even more proud to own a vinyl copy of it which I bought in our little (Northern German small town) record store in the year of release.
LE
You are proud that you own a terrible record that was only released so the record company could indulge the bass player in their biggest cash cow at the time? ;)
Dusty Valentino has spoken.
I forgot that records are never made to make money, sorry.
LE
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Very interesting story Ed, I always wondered why JI would had done that strange ep and under that name... mistery solved!
Regarding Glass, I think "Never told a sould" was good, but Glass is less good in many terms, but quite decent for the bassman of a massive band :)
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The cover and the letter styles seems to remind a bit to the Twisting by the Pool EP, is just a coincidence or was done on purpose?
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"Sold less than Glass"! I'm dying over here ;D
I owned Glass at some point in the 90s. The best thing about that album is the contributions by Jerry Donahue. He out-Marks Mark. Listen to this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=scRPh58tLdY
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Interesting information. Thank you Mr. B.
I remember buying a used copy of this, a long time ago, only because of the association with DS. Hardly played it a couple of times. Glass was easier to find, at the nice price section, and I picked up a brand new copy of that, thrilled that MK was playing on a couple of tracks. Unfortunately it didn't sound anything like DS.
I think that we can discuss about such projects, vanity, companies and success, from the stand point of the fan, consumer, music aficionado, amateur music critic, sociologist and psychologist. I remember when I was getting one cassette every 3-4 months, that I played it to death, until I knew it inside out. If I kept this pace, 40 years after, I would have merely 160 tapes. From what I gather, the records that become hits, are the ones that people that buy only 3-4 records each year, chose to buy. The rest are either lost in obscurity or are plenty in the dollar bins. I also recall that records like Fleetwood Mac's Rumours and Boston - S/T were also in the dollar bin, although they are great records. Yet now, an old nice copy of either one of them is slightly cheaper than a new reissue. I guess this is the law of offer and demand.
Now why do I mention all these.
I would love to know who decides how many records are cut and how he arrives to that decision. And what happens when the decision is wrong. I guess that cutting several thousands of a record brings the cost down and if it is successful you feed the demand, so the record rides the charts due to sales. While small releases, even if they are initially successful, due to the small first run, they sell out quickly, and if demand is not met immediately, they lose momentum and are forgotten. I mean we have examples of good records that sold very little, but the quantity was small to begin with, while there are others that were marketed more aggressively, with many copies placed at record shops and equally many returned, or sold after months in the dollar bin. I remember reading many books, containing these matters, like Rockonomics, or Appetite for self destruction, etc. There was a mention of RSO that after the great success of Saturday Night Fever, started marketing wildly their disco releases, and that demanded great quantities. After the failure of several records, and massive returns, the company folded.
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I have it too, in my collection. There are two versions known, a 12-inch maxi single and a 7-inch single. UK-releases only, as far as i know. OK, it seems to be a kind of "side project" by some DS bandmembers. I don´t have further information on the sales-statistics of that record in the UK or elsewhere. There is no CD-single release as far as i know.